L2 Punisher 3 Recovery Questions

[frogglicker]

Good evening,

I received a Punisher 3 from my super awesome TRF Secret Santa this year and I thought this would be the perfect rocket to get my L2 cert. Today, I find myself struggling with the sim file to find a motor where the apogee is within the 14 second delay. I want to keep my L2 cert simple, but I'm at the point where Dual Deployment would make things much easier albeit a little more complicated. I had a path to launch for the L2 but this kit changes things somewhat and I would really like to fly the P3. I wanted to get some advice and feedback on my thought process to make sure I'm not doing something monumentally stupid.

My plan was to do my L2 launch in March/April of 2024. The idea was just simply take a baby "J" S/U motor and get it done. However, I am at a point where my instincts and my skill level says to launch this rocket on H and I motors and begin getting some experience using electronic deployment with motor backup this spring and then this summer, punch the L2 cert flight in the mouth using DD on a J-motor. I have 8, H-210/220/250 flights under my belt and they have all gone well, so I'm comfortable with RMS motor assembly, prepping the rocket, going through my checklist, etc. I have had more issues with DMS motor delays but this plan makes the delay a moot point. I am thinking if I can get 5-10 more successful H/I launches behind me, then I should be good for the L2 flight. As an alternative, I could go with single, electronic deployment on the drogue channel and use the main channel as the backup vs. traditional DD.

Does this sound viable? I appreciate any advice and feedback you can offer.

Enjoy what's left of your weekend.

Dave Frey

 

[gloy]

I would recheck your numbers , I don't know what that punisher 3 would weigh but my Hyperloc 300 weighs 4lbs. And needs 12 second delay with a j250w goes 4100 ft. Should be doable for you with that rocket.
But dd is very reliable, I did my l2 with it works great. Either way will get you there. Good luck.

 

[frogglicker]

Thank you. I really need to pull out the ruler and scale and verify the sim. I think I'm getting to that point where I want to move to the next phase, but the sim still needs to be accurate. I just noticed that the NC coupler is not accurate. I suspect other "deviations" are at play.

 

[frogglicker]

Found this on ThrustCurve. All three of these motors are SU and all come in under 14sec. Yeah, something is wrong with the sim. I'll go through it and get it sorted then report back.

 

[danielhv]

another thing to consider is in rocksim I have it show me the recommended motors, then allow it to show me the ones that are NOT recommended. Sometimes you’ll find some on the not recommended list that would be just fine, but aren’t being shown because the off-rail velocity is .1mph under the threshold.

 

[MrPoopyPants]

I’ve flown the 3” punisher numerous times. J to K. Even with a little J motor your pushing altitude where dual deployment is almost a must. If you go motor deploy you’ll probably want some really good tracking. It won’t be in visual range for long.

I only bring this up because setting the rocket up for an H flight is a lot different than a J flight. Might as well do it only once

WM rkt files are not exactly plug and play. But the kit is top notch.

Also, good on the Secret Santa. Special place in heaven for that person!

 

[MrPoopyPants]

I’ve flown the 3” punisher numerous times. J to K. Even with a little J motor your pushing altitude where dual deployment is almost a must. If you go motor deploy you’ll probably want some really good tracking. It won’t be in visual range for long.

I only bring this up because setting the rocket up for an H flight is a lot different than a J flight. Might as well do it only once

WM rkt files are not exactly plug and play. But the kit is top notch.

Also, good on the Secret Santa. Special place in heaven for that person!

Well now I’m thinking about this a little bit. If you can get the adapter I bet that thing would absolutely rip on an I500!

 

[loopy]

I would set this up for DD and fly it on some big H loads and some I loads to make sure you have the DD steps down cold, then throw a J in it and get your L2 with a lot more confidence.

 

[frogglicker]

I would set this up for DD and fly it on some big H loads and some I loads to make sure you have the DD steps down cold, then throw a J in it and get your L2 with a lot more confidence.

That is my current plan since I think I have the sim dialed in now. My thought is that it isn't a race. Having DD locked down, my GPS tracker and flight comp. configured, and a few more launches on H/I motors will help refine the procedures of new skills, and while not an immediate considerations, sets the stage for L3. The H550 sims out to just under 2200 feet with a ~10 sec delay, so I can drill it out to 12 and use as a "ballistic prevention" backup along with electronic backups. This should more than plenty to get the mechanics down without having to drive 3 miles to find it.

Here's what I'm thinking/planning for the rest of the summer:

• Build the Punisher for HEDD
• Include Eggtimer Quasar/Quantum as primary and backup Flight Comp/GPS
• Get in a couple of flights with motor ejection backup to make sure I'm good to go without motor eject
• Get in a few H and I flights to stretch the GPS
• Full Send this fall (well, with a baby J)

 

[droopy]

That is my current plan since I think I have the sim dialed in now. My thought is that it isn't a race. Having DD locked down, my GPS tracker and flight comp. configured, and a few more launches on H/I motors will help refine the procedures of new skills, and while not an immediate considerations, sets the stage for L3. The H550 sims out to just under 2200 feet with a ~10 sec delay, so I can drill it out to 12 and use as a "ballistic prevention" backup along with electronic backups. This should more than plenty to get the mechanics down without having to drive 3 miles to find it.

Here's what I'm thinking/planning for the rest of the summer:

• Build the Punisher for HEDD
• Include Eggtimer Quasar/Quantum as primary and backup Flight Comp/GPS
• Get in a couple of flights with motor ejection backup to make sure I'm good to go without motor eject
• Get in a few H and I flights to stretch the GPS
• Full Send this fall (well, with a baby J)

Yet another thing to consider. Once I figured out DD, I absolutely hate motor ejection. I go DD on lots of rockets that motor ejection would work just as well, but for me, DD is much more reliable. I don't have to worry about the accuracy of the delay grain burn rate, did I drill out enough or to much, etc.

That being said, during the process of learning DD, I did have a few, umm, significant learning events... Make sure batteries and wiring are secured. Both the G's at launch and the violence of the apogee event and subsequent tumbling can disconnect things you were positive wouldn't. Don't forget the pressure holes. And especially while figuring out how YOU want to do DD, write and use a checklist. Nothing more frustrating that realizing the reason you crashed was you got distracted for a second out at the pad and forgot to turn on the electronics!

Like you said, it's not a race. I love learning and continuing to challenge myself with new aspects of this hobby. I'd figure out the DD (and maybe get an Eggtimer mini tracker and a receiver as well) and once you're comfortable with both, Do a Full Send with the biggest motor you can fit in it and stay under your waiver! Go big or go home!

Either way, good luck and have fun on the journey to your L2 and L3!

 

[loopy]

That is my current plan since I think I have the sim dialed in now. My thought is that it isn't a race. Having DD locked down, my GPS tracker and flight comp. configured, and a few more launches on H/I motors will help refine the procedures of new skills, and while not an immediate considerations, sets the stage for L3. The H550 sims out to just under 2200 feet with a ~10 sec delay, so I can drill it out to 12 and use as a "ballistic prevention" backup along with electronic backups. This should more than plenty to get the mechanics down without having to drive 3 miles to find it.

Here's what I'm thinking/planning for the rest of the summer:

• Build the Punisher for HEDD
• Include Eggtimer Quasar/Quantum as primary and backup Flight Comp/GPS
• Get in a couple of flights with motor ejection backup to make sure I'm good to go without motor eject
• Get in a few H and I flights to stretch the GPS
• Full Send this fall (well, with a baby J)

I love the "it isn't a race" part. There's a lot to learn at each level of rocketry. Glad you're not rushing, and taking your time lo learn as you go!

 

[Rudedawg]

Nice, I did both my L1 and L2 on my 3 inch Punisher. L1 on an I500 motor ejection and later a baby J435 with motor ejection and a Jolly Logic Chute Release at 800 ft. I have since flown it on a J540 to 8200 ft.

Great solid rocket. I've since extended mine for a true DD config and plan to next launch it on a K700

 

[KenECoyote]

FWIW The 3" Punisher was my first DD attempt and it was an amazing learning experience. While my dd setup and build may seem a bit rough, it always functioned well and I used some of it as a basis for my later projects.

The Punisher kit was designed to be HED (the first maybe) and is considered by many to be an almost perfect HP rocket design, so why not try learning dd on that, especially given there's no rush to cert - and imho there shouldn't be for L2 & L3 (btw don't look up my attempts ).

 

[KenECoyote]

I would also suggest first trying to set up dd using a single altimeter to keep things simple and the motor ejection would be the backup for motors up to I. Punish it with sone hard hitting motors for fun and to stress test. Tracking would also be helpful.

Then if it's working well at that point, you can try adding a second altimeter for those bigger motors (leave some space for it when first building) or at that point you may have more experience and want to try a larger L2 dd rocket.

 

[Glasspack]

OMG You all are making me want to complete the order I have waiting in my Cart from Wildman..............

I put the 3" Punisher kit in the cart....... but, can't find the courage to push the button !!

 

[crossfire]

3" Punisher is a great kit.

 

[KenECoyote]

OMG You all are making me want to complete the order I have waiting in my Cart from Wildman..............

I put the 3" Punisher kit in the cart....... but, can't find the courage to push the button !!

Why are you Punishing yourself?

 

[frogglicker]

OMG You all are making me want to complete the order I have waiting in my Cart from Wildman..............

I put the 3" Punisher kit in the cart....... but, can't find the courage to push the button !!

DO IT!!!

 

[Philip Tiberius D.]

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