Estes Pro Series II Ventris Kit

I just received a box from Penrose, Colorado.

Inside was a new Pro Series II Ventris kit.

First impression: Looks good.

I will open the package later and take a better look at it. This model now goes to the top of my build list.

SWEEET!

how much was it?

RocketManDan said:

how much was it?

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They definitely don't have that all over the internet or anything. :kill:

eggplant said:

They definitely don't have that all over the internet or anything. :kill:

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No doubt

Just asking...if you want me to look whatever! Doesn't matter I would never support a company that produces inferior rocket kits and products.

RocketManDan said:

Just asking...if you want me to look whatever! Doesn't matter I would never support a company that produces inferior rocket kits and products.

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????

SacEsq said:

????

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You can clone it for less...use better materials and parts

RocketManDan said:

how much was it?

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The Estes Ventris is slightly taller than the Aerotech Initiator and an ounce heavier. Otherwise it is has a striking resemblance to the Initiator.

The Ventris lists for $5 more then the Initiator, it's $64.95.

Maybe they sent one to Bob 'Gratis'... after all he is Initiator001

RocketManDan said:

Just asking...if you want me to look whatever! Doesn't matter I would never support a company that produces inferior rocket kits and products.

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So why even bother being a part of this thread?

scsager said:

The Estes Ventris is slightly taller than the Aerotech Initiator and an ounce heavier. Otherwise it is has a striking resemblance to the Initiator.

The Ventris lists for $5 more then the Initiator, it's $64.95.

Maybe they sent one to Bob 'Gratis'... after all he is Initiator001

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Here also ....... but not yet https://www.hobbylinc.com/htm/est/est9701.htm

In the photo did I see TTW fin slots ?


John

RocketManDan said:

Just asking...if you want me to look whatever! Doesn't matter I would never support a company that produces inferior rocket kits and products.

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In your opinion. Literally thousands have enjoyed the estes product line.
Cheers
fred

scsager said:

The Estes Ventris is slightly taller than the Aerotech Initiator and an ounce heavier. Otherwise it is has a striking resemblance to the Initiator.

The Ventris lists for $5 more then the Initiator, it's $64.95.

Maybe they sent one to Bob 'Gratis'... after all he is Initiator001

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I'd like to think that various hobby rocket manufacturers will send me their products 'gratis' but, sadly, I am only a mere mortal like the rest of you.

I purchased my Ventris kit directly from the Estes online website when the kit became listed as being available to order. Estes gladly took my credit card information and four days later the kit was delivered by my local postman.

As for looking like an Initiator...I would say "not".

johnnwwa said:

In the photo did I see TTW fin slots ?


John

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Yes, you are correct.

The plywood fins have about a 3/8" deep tab which goes through the body tube slots.

This kit has many body tubes, probably to allow a smaller package. All the tubes have thicker walls than standard Estes tubing.

The motor tube appears to be 8"-10" long, plenty for an AeroTeck-like baffle system.

I'll get around to opening the package on Friday and taking a closer look at the parts.

rokitflite said:

So why even bother being a part of this thread?

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because I like wearing the black hat!

RocketManDan said:

because I like wearing the black hat!

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No need to be so negative and hostile all the time tho ... just sayin'

RocketManDan said:

because I like wearing the black hat!

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Unless your name is Cash it can irritate your peers. Balance is nice. I like these new estes MPR kits and look forward to hearing more about them in this thread.
Cheers
Fred

Okay, I have opened the Ventris kit and looked over the parts and instructions. A picture of the parts is attached.

Here are my thoughts on the model so far.

The Good

Heavier/thicker walled body tubes

Nicely made slots in the lower body tube for the fin tabs-just big enough for the fin tabs to fit through

Nose cone and tube adapter made out of polystyrene-firm/doesn't flex like other poly-plastics used for nose cones, paint will adhere better

Three centering rings for the motor mount tube

Nicely laser-cut plywood fins-very firm and tough (I had a heck of a time trying to round the leading edge with a sanding block)

1/2" wide flat elastic shock cord

Screw-on motor retainer

The Bad

Instructions-I understand the desire make the instructions tri-lingual but some steps lack enough verbage to be clear, the motor mount assembly for one

Paper tri-fold shock cord anchor-This has to be the largest copy of the classic Estes paper folded shock cord mount I have ever seen in a kit. I was expecting a more 'robust' method of attaching the shock cord to the main body tube

The 2.0"/2.5" plastic tube adapter shoulder is undersized on the 2.0" side. The fit is very loose. The shoulder will need to be built up

The Ugly

No decals

Well, not exacly. A small 'Estes Pro Series II' decal is included but those black roll patterns are not included in the kit.

Now, I wouldn't normally make a big deal of it as I could mask and paint or buy trim Monokote to replicate the pattern but there was a notice in the finishing section of the instructions about the roll pattern decals:

"Optional decal scheme purchase separately at estesrockets.com"

What?!

If I want the decals I have to pay extra?!!

I couldn't believe it.

I did go to the Estes webpage to try and find the decals but no luck.

I called Estes but when you press the button/number for customer service a message tells you to go to the Estes webpage and 'click' on the 'contact us' button (Send an e-mail).

I did as instructed and I have yet to receive a reply about the decals.



I was looking very forward to Estes taking another shot at the mid-power rocketry market as I think it has alot of growth potential but this latest offering leaves me a little bit underwhelmed.

I still plan to purchase more of the Pro Series II line (I am looking forward to the Nike Smoke) but with the realization that there may be more effort and cost (decals) involved.

As of now, I have sanded the fins and sealed them with FnF (They will probably only need one coat). I have sealed the ends of all the body tubes with CA and applied a coat of FnF over each tube. I plan to install an AeroTech-like mesh baffle (BTW the motor tube is 8" long) and wrap some kevlar line around the motor mount tube to anchor the shock cord.

This is Estes thrid go-around with mid-power rocketry. If I were to compare it with the original Pro Series products and the North Coast Rocketry By Estes (NCRBE) product line I would rate the Pro Series II kits an improvement over the original Pro Series kits but not as good as the NCRBE kits.

YMMV.

I look forward to what others will have to say about building/flying these models.

I didn't realize plywood fins needed to be filled? I thought maybe just a good sanding and high build primer would do the trick?

Kind of a bummer about having to pay extra for decals. I wonder how much they are? Probably $10-15. So that would probably push the kit to over $75 with decals. That doesn't surprise me seeing you have to by their igniters separate from the engines.

Tri fold mount? You think with a MPR kit they would include a better way to fasten the shock cord? I guess an eye screw would cost too much money.

I can get past decals,esspecially if they are of the peel `n stick variety ,no big deal....

BUT the old "Tri-fold method" for a SC mount.....really

Nice kit otherwise.


Paul T

I’ve not seen a real loose fit on any of the nose cones or transitions to date but I know it does happen.

As for the folded paper shock cord attachment; they work great and I’ve not had one fail on any of the Pro Series models yet. If you wish to blame someone, blame me, not Estes for this.

A fellow club member built one of the models, modified it with a heavy duty shock cord attachment down at the engine mount and he was rewarded with an 8” long zippered body tube on his first flight when the ejection charge went off prematurely. I’ve personally never had good luck with the models I’ve built with Kevlar attached to the motor tube since the Kevlar has always burned through in time. I knew the die hard modelers out there weren’t gong to like our standard shock cord mounting but the simple fact is for the majority of people who are going to fly these models, the old try and trued system works just fine. I also know from hanging around modelers for the past 40 years, is, that no matter what shock cord system was included in the kit, a certain percentage of people would change it out for their preferred system.

As for decals, only two of the models used them, the Leviathan and Ventris. The Leviathan could still be easily masked and painted while the checker board pattern on the Ventris would be a real pain to do. The price of these two kits would have gone up quite a bit so the decals were left out. You also must realize only about 15% of kits actually get painted with the color schemes shown on the packaging. As of today decals won’t be offered for sale for these two kits on the web site. This could change. I believe painting instructions with dimensions for all four models and maybe a full size PDF file will be available for download for the two kits mentioned above. I’m sure the after market companies can supply you will something to put on your model if needed.

The Nike Smoke does come with two United States water slide decals and has the same tri-folded paper shock cord attachment.

You will be happy to know that the sixth model in the series will in fact have a full huge set of water slide decals. I will also have the same shock cord but now it will be attached to the top plywood centering ring. I was able to do this only because I felt the diameter of the body tube allowed the shock cord to be far enough away from the ejection gases to survive. Simply adding a screw eye and attaching a shock cord two it while it is sitting next to hot ejection gasses isn’t the best thing to do, in my opinion. I’m sure some of you will change this attachment method as well, but that is of course what modeling is all about. I would recommend using the folded paper attachment method if you don’t wish to attach the shock cord to the motor mount. I hear this method works great!

All the models come with the new plastic 29mm screw on engine retainer system so you won’t have to go out and purchase an after market aluminum one that costs a third of the price of these kits. They are of course real nice and I’ve purchased them in the past for my own personal models.

John Boren

Well said, John. Many good points, there. Especially about the potential for Kevlar to zipper a tube. Took me a couple of builds to realize that the kevlar shouldn't extend out the end of the tube!

Bob,

I just noticed something wrong with the parts shown in one of your posts. There appear to be two 29mm motor blocks in case the modeler wishes to use one. There should only be one of these. There should have been a different green ring that was 29mm ID to fit over the motor tube. This is used to help align the plywood rings when tack gluing them in place on the motor mount. The model can be built with out it, but I find it very helpful to use.

John Boren

JumpJet said:

The Nike Smoke does come with two United States water slide decals and has the same tri-folded paper shock cord attachment.

You will be happy to know that the sixth model in the series will in fact have a full huge set of water slide decals.
John Boren

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Ummm..a 6th model? Nice! I'm really likin' the Nike Smoke, when will it be available? And the Mystery 6th kit?

I am not a big fan of rockets with transitions, but both the Ventris and Argent look nice....

Bob, you gonna post when you're going to launch it?

Nike Smoke, when will it be available? And the Mystery 6th kit?

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Sorry, but I cant give a specific date on when they will be released other then it will be in 2012.


John Boren

JumpJet said:

Sorry, but I cant give a specific date on when they will be released other then it will be in 2012.


John Boren

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Need a BETA tester?

Thanks to Gordy/Sandman/Excelsior Rocketry ( ), I now have decals for my Estes Ventris kit.

They look great!

As to the status of my Ventris build I recently installed my modified motor mount with baffle system. My next steps will be to connect the two main body tube together, seal the seam then instll the fins.

I am looking forward to finishing this model.

so any progress?

"huge decal sheet", large diameter body tube?
Pershing???
Come on JumpJet, how about a hint on the 6th model!!!!

Initiator001 said:

Thanks to Gordy/Sandman/Excelsior Rocketry ( ), I now have decals for my Estes Ventris kit.

They look great!

As to the status of my Ventris build I recently installed my modified motor mount with baffle system. My next steps will be to connect the two main body tube together, seal the seam then instll the fins.

I am looking forward to finishing this model.

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Not being absolutely sure of the Ventris body tube diameter on the right of the decal sheet is a set of "cheater" stripes just in case.
I figured if the dimensions are off one slightly wider stripe was better then a gap.

I included some more smaller checkerboard stripes at the bottom too. Just to fill up the sheet.

I hate sending blank decal paper.