Apogee Aspire - Any Supersonic Success Stories?

[RocketTheBruce]

I'm wondering if anyone has had any success with the Apogee Aspire going supersonic and returning in a re-flyable condition? I've had three of them. I have destroyed with two of them G80-10 motors (one at LDRS 40), and lost a third one on a F20-7 motor. At least with my failure last weekend, I was able to recover some of the debris for the accident investigation. I used the Fly-Away Rail Guides last time. All four epoxied fins separated from the airframe tube, something I've never had happen before. Maybe going supersonic is too much for paper and balsa wood. Videos on YouTube channel KK6WYV. Thanks, Bruce

 

[grillsjosephbus]

Mr. Rocket loves you

 

[waltr]

Did the fins come off at launch or later in the flight?
If 'at launch' it could have been the rail guides.

 

[Back_at_it]

Nope. I lose everyone I build and I've never flown anything more than and E12-8 in that rocket. They are great fliers on a D12-7

 

[ljwilley]

I know a guy who did it- or at least he said he did it...

 

[pcalvin]

I've witnessed a few of them survive on the old G80, not sure about the new. Required tissue paper / CA fins. I don't recall if it was tip to tip or just the balsa itself. They would get the supersonic ones back, its the F10 that kissed them goodbye.

 

[Art Upton]

I'm wondering if anyone has had any success with the Apogee Aspire going supersonic and returning in a re-flyable condition? I've had three of them. I have destroyed with two of them G80-10 motors (one at LDRS 40), and lost a third one on a F20-7 motor. At least with my failure last weekend, I was able to recover some of the debris for the accident investigation. I used the Fly-Away Rail Guides last time. All four epoxied fins separated from the airframe tube, something I've never had happen before. Maybe going supersonic is too much for paper and balsa wood. Videos on YouTube channel KK6WYV. Thanks, Bruce

Yes you need to use hard thin basswood or plywood. I have flown a Estes Asender on plastic fins with my special way to seal the fins but no fillets at all on a H135 at 2017 October fest along with the Parizion on an I205 twice on plywood with only gorilla glue and no real outside fillets.

Only sealing the fins slot with a light coat of wood glue [or in other rockets silicon sealer]. This is only to keep air from getting into the fin sloit.

 

[Art Upton]

I also busted the old Enerjet 1340 rocket that became an Estes Eliminator on a G125 , plastic fins busted at 300 feet.

on an Eliss Mountain H50 , it had no problems and I got that one back. I made a Streach one and I think, but cannot be sure I flew it on an Ellis I69 and it was lost at LDRS 23, but came back in a lost and found box the next morning.

 

[ksaves2]

Yes, I've had 3 successes and lost 4 of them. One was at my home field a sometimes golf driving range. The others were at a large rocket launch venue.
The two I got back were found by other fliers looking for their projects. The other one I launched at my home field and thought I lost. It was gone so long after the launch and I didn't get a visual on it. I assumed it was lost. That was fine as it was getting well used. I starting to prep the next rocket and then started hearing the rattling of the mylar streamer I used. I looked up and there it was coming in not too far from me. Pure luck.

 

[John_461]

successful flight on a G80 recovered about 1/2 mile from the pad

 

[86mustang408w]

I'm going to be doing one soon. Should be interesting...

 

[Wrightme43]

I got one ready, when the weather cooperates. Lol!

 

[86mustang408w]

I got one ready, when the weather cooperates. Lol!

Cool! I was looking at the altitudes on the cars they give you, and motors they tested with this. I want to see what an H does, well I was told 8/9,000 feet. Did you go with 3 or 4 fins?

 

[Wrightme43]

Three fins, I doubt it will go supersonic.
I papered the fins, epoxy filets, but it still has a launch lug.

 

[86mustang408w]

Three fins, I doubt it will go supersonic.
I papered the fins, epoxy filets, but it still has a launch lug.

Thats nice, I love yellow! It may go Supersonic. I'm still debating on how I want mine done.

 

[Wrightme43]

I will probably build another one someday, and do things differently.

I ordered a little decorative punch wheel.
I believe tiny holes in the body tube along the fin root, and filet center and along the fin sides where filet will be, would create tiny rivits of epoxy that may keep the fins on better.

What I am worried about is, pulling a fin on launch, a wind gust at just the wrong time, and it going horizontal.

I have (2) F20-7 dms motors.
I am going to start with a E estes and if it comes back, try the F. I only have a Jolly Logic 2 altimeter and there ain't no way I am sending it up in that. Lol.

Maybe if I can find a cheapo.

 

[ksaves2]

I'm wondering if anyone has had any success with the Apogee Aspire going supersonic and returning in a re-flyable condition? I've had three of them. I have destroyed with two of them G80-10 motors (one at LDRS 40), and lost a third one on a F20-7 motor. At least with my failure last weekend, I was able to recover some of the debris for the accident investigation. I used the Fly-Away Rail Guides last time. All four epoxied fins separated from the airframe tube, something I've never had happen before. Maybe going supersonic is too much for paper and balsa wood. Videos on YouTube channel KK6WYV. Thanks, Bruce

I flew several. Lost a couple of them and recovered most of them. I think I put 3/4 ounce fiberglass mat on the fins with epoxy. No fin separation. Still have one downstairs somewhere.
I had one go lost at a launch with a G80 and a fellow flier returned it. I had it marked so I was called. Took about a year to get together and get it back. That was no big deal to me as I knew it was in good hands.
Had another go lost and I was triapsing out in the field to get another rocket (it had GPS tracking in it, got it back) and I found the remains of another Aspire I flew. The cardboard melted in the rain but the epoxied fin can was intact. I would'a thought the farmer's plow would have turned it into the soil of the cornfield but it was lying right on the surface.
Now did they go supersonic? I don't know as I added re-enforcement on the fins. Added weight you know. But I did launch one at the public golf driving range early one morning on the G80 and it disappeared. I did modrocs there. I stared into the ether for awhile and thought, "I lost another one" and when preparing the next modroc, I hear the rattling of the silver mylar streamer coming in. The Aspire came down in the field and I didn't have a long walk to get it.
With my streamer recovered rockets, I use a silvered mylar material (usually two of them) that I fan fold and it "rattles" really loudly. Out in the middle of nowhere at a "private" launch, by myself, I can hear the rockets coming in on the silver mylar streamers. Have fun. Kurt

 

[NTP2]

I flew 3 all shredded RIP.

 

[snrkl]

Stumbled back on to this thread as I plan my next Aspire project..

I have flown several of these and recovered every single one (well, two instances where I only got the NC with GPS and A3 back. but that's OK).

I have yet to get a completely clean set of telemetry that shows Mach1 of a flight the airframe could be reused.
Also worth noting that the flight on a G80 either maxes out the accelerometer on the JLA3 I have. or comes damn close.

It has taken me a while to build up the airframe where it needs it.
https://www.rocketryforum.com/threads/a-supersonic-apogee-aspire.142536/ covers the mods to the nosecone I make with a 29mm vitamin tube, so that I have room for an eggfinder mini and a JLA3 in the NC)

1. Aspera-I Oct 2017: was a full size aspire on an F35. [Correction - checked my flight log] - GPS in NC, so I got the NC back, but the airframe when the harness attachment point broke (as I am stupid). The separated airframe was lost it in a field - returned after 3 months after the farmer found it, and I recovered my motor hardware.
2. Aspera-II Nov 2017: cut down with double diamond fins (paper laminated, coated with CA, then epoxied with epoxy putty fillets) flew on a G80. Maxed out the A3 accelerometer at 24Gs. NC separated from the airframe, but NC, streamer and avionics recovered
3. Aspera-III flew twice.
   1. March 2018 - Max Speed recorded was 873kph, but the A3 bay was not vented sufficiently, and the altitude graph showed the rocket going -100m on launch as the air in the bay compressed at >20Gs (again, peak maxed out the 24G sensor in the JLA3)
   2. April 2018 (JLA3 battery died on the pad - no data recorded) Recovered successfully
4. Aspera-IV July 2021- Max speed 1134.6 kph, but a small defect on the tip of one fin caused it to corkscrew on launch. Peak accel 32.91 Gs Avg accel 25.66 Gs (accelerometer is max 24Gs, so I assume it uses time/altitude to cross correlate?)
5. Aspera-V July 2021 -Max speed 880.0 kph, Peak accel 23.07 Gs. Motor took a while to pressurize on ignition, so I think this might have caused sub-optimal thrust. Recovered on the other side of the river (Egg Finder mini is amazing) on a farm, and was 100% intact, until my son sat on the fin while winding the kevlar back up, and popped the fin.

So, all up, I have a strong record of recovery, but I am still yet to get a clean set of telemetry that shows Mach1 on a G80.

Now as luck would have it, I managed to get 5x 29mm H motors, so I am now thinking about a carbon fibre Aspire, slightly modified to fly on an H135... I need to keep it under 5000ft, so time will tell what I do with it..

Also, my JLA3 and EFMini have been in deep storage since COVID made rocketry impossible and expensive, so avionics might need to be completely revisited, and I might have to delve into my project box to see what @cerving kits I have unassembled from years gone by...

 

[kjhambrick]

I don't have an Apogee Aspire nor have I ever sim'd one but @manixFan reported his adventures recovering Matt Bukin's 9200 ft flight on an AT DMS H13 at the TNT Seymour, TX site here: TRF > Forums > Manufacturers, Vendors, Sales & Deals > Yard Sale / Wanted > For Sale Custom Comspec Receiver Compatible Beacons > Post #94

I don't believe Matt is a TRF member and I am not sure what the Max Velocity was during the thrust phase but maybe Tony has more info ?

-- kjh

 

[bad_idea]

I don't believe Matt is a TRF member and I am not sure what the Max Velocity was during the thrust phase but maybe Tony has more info ?

Matt is @Newguy

 

[SolarYellow]

I reckon it would be a lot cheaper to build these as fly-away-or-shred, and you'll get a lot faster and a lot higher. Just leave out the MMT and go MD.

https://www.acsupplyco.com/quest-1020

The fins look a little skinny and flutter-prone to me. I'd probably do a little different shape.