Dr. Zooch Vanguard Eagle- Beta Build Thread

[luke strawwalker]

Yea Luke Shoot it!, Blast it Off, Fire it up!, Just flip the switch baby, Press the button and let her fly, Squeeze it off the rack, Flame it up, Put the Fire in the first stage hole then Pop off the second, Cook it off on the gap stage, Match in the nozzle (Is this a Heavenly Hobbies Backdraft?), Spark that powder, Flash in the pan, Roast the Toast, Slap that baby on the bottom, Ready-Aim-Fire, light the fuse, Let ‘er rip, Lets open that two stage can of whoop a**, Fry the sky, Chuff the Magic Dragon, Flame that bird, Kick it in the a**, Punch a hole in the sky, Lit the Stick with a BIC (oops – that was another Zooch kit), Now sever it's earthly bonds, We gotta lite that DY-NO-MITE (best Good Times impression), Throw it up into the wild blue yonder!

YEAH YEAH, OKAY, OKAY!!!!! :y::shock::jaw::blush:

Geez... wettest July here in the last 10 years and I'm getting the same lecture Al Shepard gave the control room prior to Freedom 7... GEEZ!!!

Can't exactly help it that we've got ANOTHER 2 inches of rain in the last two days! Standing water sorta impedes the process ya know...

Tell you what-- I'll try to get this thing fired off from the Shiner farm the next time I go, if I can't get any dry weather here before then. The rain has the whole place up there grown up 2-3 feet high in grass and weeds that the cows can't keep ahead of, but at least it's dry.

From the sound of the Doc's posts, I can pretty much write off the top stage. The first stage is the detailed on, anyway, so as long as I get that one back, I can write off the top stage-- it's just a typical 4 FNC type upperstage, easily replaced, even having to replace the capsule wouldn't be much work...

I'll see what I can do... I PROMISE GUYS!!! SERIOUSLY!

Look on the bright side-- at least the cows are well fed... that should mean more money for the space program (rocket funds) this fall...

I'll keep yall apprised.... OL JR

 

[luke strawwalker]

Cool, as soon as I get my Level 3 I think I will then be qualified to try to bullet proof one just like the Sport Rocketry article with the Estes Guardian. Ditch the trash bag chute for some thin mill dry cleaner bags, weight it up with reinforcements, put in some C motors and let the guaranteed awsomeness begin. :bangbang::shock::eyepop::bangpan:

Don't forget to stick a ten penny nail sticking up out of the top of the nosecone with about a half-pound of loose BB's inside the nosecone for extra noseweight... That should REALLY make that tank-killer look cool! :y:

Besides, you don't want to just WOUND somebody... ya wanna finish the job right if it goes askew... :bangbang: No coup de gras allowed...

Geez.... and folks wonder why I'm reticent about HPR...

Why stop there?? Launch on an 18 mm composite, airstarting 4 outboard A10's, staging to an 18mm composite upperstage, complete with dual deploy...


Let the mayhem begin... OL JR

 

[Rex R]

or you could modify your pad...I've launched from a dingy .
rex

 

[luke strawwalker]

or you could modify your pad...I've launched from a dingy .
rex

We're not quite THAT bad off... yet! Still, compared to the drought of last year and worrying about potentially hungry cows, and how to feed them through the winter, too much rain delaying a rocket launch is barely on the radar-- I'll take it every day of the week and twice on Sunday!

At any rate, we're SUPPOSED to have a slightly drier weekend here, so we'll see...

Later! OL JR

PS. the Vanguard Eagle isn't as waterproof as that rocket looks to be...

 

[JRThro]

I'll take it every day of the week and twice on Sunday!

That's pretty much the way we've been getting it, isn't it?

 

[Jordan_RochellaSpace]

or you could modify your pad...I've launched from a dingy .
rex

I'd love to do that. Ala Sea Launch.

However, it might set the Gulf on fire.

 

[Dr.Zooch]

Well?....

tap, tap, tap....

Is this thing on?op:

 

[luke strawwalker]

Well?....

tap, tap, tap....

Is this thing on?op:

Sorry, things have been a bit crazy here lately...

SWMBO has 'drafted' me into the cleanup/rearranging brigade-- our nephew just got his bachelor's in aeronautical engineering with his minor in nuke engineering from Purdue and is in the process of moving in with us here in TX. So, the *we*decided it was a good idea to go ahead and clear out some stuff we didn't really need from both back bedrooms-- one of which the cat pretty much took over, in addition to storage, and the other belonging to my five year old who has ENTIRELY too much junk. SO, we've been hip deep in sifting/sorting/hauling to "The Amazing Place" Christian resale shop (what?? they're reselling Christians?? no not really, misplaced modifier?? LOL) and all the stuff related to that. In addition, school is about to restart, I've pulled a 2000 Ford Escort (Dad's old work car before he ended up on disability) out of storage where it's sat for most of five years and brought it back to life for my wife to drive the 30-odd miles each way to her school daily since she couldn't find a job closer to home, in addition to the usual family issues, fixing Dad's lawnmower twice (spending half a day hunting a coil ground wire short one day) and the usual assortment of minor emergencies required to keep this place functional, including repairing a PVC water pipe out by the well that a cow snapped off last evening while we were gone shopping, and which I couldn't fix last night for lack of parts and the fact that the fire ants decided to build a nest directly over the water pipe that I had to dig up, and they weren't particularly happy about that (and made that known through multiple injections of formic acid to yours truly!) SO, I had to strike back with various insecticides while attempting pipe repairs in the interim. Add to that, after the two weeks straight of rain we had in mid July, things are now pretty dry, but now the wind is up.

In addition, when I HAVE been able to slip online in the past few days, I've been trying to figure out what's up with the club that launches here on the farm, since someone let the charter lapse in February and it's in the process of being reinstated, and I've had a few inquiries as to whether the club launches could go ahead or not and trying to figure out the status of all that... and of course the launch today ended up cancelled because of those issues and as well as the water well problem this morning, I had a nice young lady show up at the house this morning asking about the launch and all that, because the club website didn't get updated that things were still in limbo... So I talked to her a few minutes and invited her to go ahead and launch since she drove out 25 miles or so to find nothing going on, but I still had to get water back on in the house so I couldn't take time to launch anything this morning... Still trading emails trying to figure out how THIS is going to get straightened out... of course I'm sure NARAM week has things in NAR HQ in a tangle as well...


I PROMISE that I'll try to slip out this evening or tomorrow IF I POSSIBLY CAN, and get the VE up in the air and report back here and to Wes at Dr. Zooch. Just been a crazy couple weeks and thrown in for good measure, summer's winding down, so the usual "back to school rush" for us school employees is starting up-- Betty's already had a couple days training inservice and I still have to get my bus physical and malarkey done, in addition to all the crapola the school requires to enter a new 5 year old in kindergarten....

I haven't even gotten to check HERE in 3-4 days!

later! OL JR

 

[Dr.Zooch]

Status?

Here's an update folks. Luke got the stack off the ground- it staged and then the second stage went unstable and crashed. Wrecked the nosecone and the tube... The suspect was an old poopy clay motor that he'd dug out of his rocket box. I've sent replacement parts and he is rebuilding for another try. We're standing by.........

We're wishing you good luck Luke- relight the candle!

 

[foose4string]

Wes, mine is built and mostly ready for flight. Just need to attach the recovery components....and it will be all white. I owe a huge apololgy for dragging my feet on these (not so) recent beta beta builds. Least I can do is try to get a flight off for you.

 

[foose4string]

Got a flight off this evening. Went B6-0 to B6-6. I wasn't able to lay my hand on a C6-0 booster right away, but had the B6-0 in the flight box already. Whichever booster motor I used I was still using the B6-6 upper stage so I could track the rocket the whole way with the diminishing daylight.

The boost, staging, and recovery went well. There was a very slight breeze(maybe 4 -5 mph) and the rocket weather cocked during the boost phase. The upper stage fired off perfectly. The upper stage traveled at a pretty steep angle and recovered a good ways up wind, but the overall flight seemed stable and the gap staging went off without a hitch.

One thing I will note is that the upper stage wouldn't seat all the way against the transition with the motor installed. there is about a 3/32" gap between the upper stage tube and lower stage transition It's been so long, I can't say for certain whether or not it was an error on my part or just one of those "beta bugs".

 

[Dr.Zooch]

Worry not my friend, I understand fully. Family FIRST at all times- rockets are just paper and balsawood.

Luke and I got a handle (I hope) on that 3/32 misfit and it should be fixed.

Looks as if this one can go into production. I'm pressed now to get my 14th book to the publisher by Oct. 31 so as soon as the manuscript is finished I can look at the new rocket releases.

Thanks for the shot! foose!

 

[Boosterdude]

Cool looking model, look forward to the kit.

 

[luke strawwalker]

Great Flight Foose!!!

Sorry I couldn't get back to yall earlier... had Friday off and went 300 miles west to relax in the Frio River this weekend at Garner State Park! VERY cool time! The weather was gorgeous and even got treated to two flyovers by some twin engine orange and white prop job Navy and Marine planes on both Friday and Saturday-- we were in the river about 1/4 mile below the dam in front of Old Baldy (sheer face mountain over the river) and these two Navy twin engine planes come zooming down the river, pull hard left, right over the river in front of Baldy at about 300-400 feet, and flew on down the river... VERY cool! Saturday we were in nearly the same spot and THREE of these orange and white birds come over-- The first and last one had Marines markings on them, the middle one was marked Navy... WAY KEWL! Those dudes can sure fly, because there was maybe 150-200 feet between those planes! Don't know what they were up to, but it was cool to see anyway!

Sorry I've been rather slow in getting the Vanguard Eagle back up and running-- I got the replacement parts and got the noseweight back into the balsa block and a new fin for the upperstage cut out and papered, but I kinda got sidetracked with some other stuff that's been going on around here lately and it's just been sitting on the workbench for awhile. I gotta get some epoxy to glue the nosecone in the bit of BT-55 above the balsa block and get the fin glued on and pick up some NEW C6-7's and I think she should be good to go. Hopefully I can get all that done this week.

I'll report back when I do. I apologize again to Dr. Zooch and everybody for not staying on top of it...

Later! OL JR

 

[Dr.Zooch]

even got treated to two flyovers by some twin engine orange and white prop job Navy and Marine planes on both Friday and Saturday-- we were in the river about 1/4 mile below the dam in front of Old Baldy (sheer face mountain over the river) and these two Navy twin engine planes come zooming down the river, pull hard left, right over the river in front of Baldy at about 300-400 feet, and flew on down the river... VERY cool! Saturday we were in nearly the same spot and THREE of these orange and white birds come over-- The first and last one had Marines markings on them, the middle one was marked Navy... WAY KEWL! Those dudes can sure fly, because there was maybe 150-200 feet between those planes! Don't know what they were up to, but it was cool to see anyway!

Awwww those guys are so cute when they're learnin' how to fly (that's why they're white and orange- to make sure senior pilots know who to stay clear of). I remember those days... about two decades and three logbooks ago. Many years ago- about 1985 or so, we had a bunch of USAF beginners flying out of my base airport. They called it their Flight Screening Program, we called it the Fright Screaming Program, because these guys all had less than a dozen hours a piece. One day, one came back from some sort of solo in a chickenhawk and and told tower (in his best pilot voice) "Requesting a low fly-by." Tower came back and answered sternly "We don't do that here." Everyone on tower freq. was cracking up.

 

[luke strawwalker]

Awwww those guys are so cute when they're learnin' how to fly (that's why they're white and orange- to make sure senior pilots know who to stay clear of). I remember those days... about two decades and three logbooks ago. Many years ago- about 1985 or so, we had a bunch of USAF beginners flying out of my base airport. They called it their Flight Screening Program, we called it the Fright Screaming Program, because these guys all had less than a dozen hours a piece. One day, one came back from some sort of solo in a chickenhawk and and told tower (in his best pilot voice) "Requesting a low fly-by." Tower came back and answered sternly "We don't do that here." Everyone on tower freq. was cracking up.

Ah ok...

Well, I don't think these were first timers by a long-shot-- they were flying pretty tight on each other's tails-- only maybe 150 feet or so apart, and flying pretty low (maybe a couple hundred feet or so) coming over Garner State Park, flying right over the river. In GSP, the river turns fairly sharply (in about 100 yards or so) to the left (east) after going over the four foot high dam, which backs up a nice 6 foot-ish deep swimming lake about 1/3 of a mile long or so behind it. The river turns left (east) at the foot of Old Baldy, a sheer-faced mountain essentially cut in two by the river, maybe 400-500 feet high to the summit above the river, no way those guys were higher than the summit... The river continues about 2/3 of a mile or so to a low water crossing, which dams the river up considerably and makes it about 30 yards wide, tapering down from a large gravel/rock bed at about a 20 degree angle from the shallows on the north side to about 20 feet deep at the base of the mountain tailings on the other bank (including some bus sized boulders and pretty tall bald cypresses).

I'll have to see if I can get the pics uploaded and posted... unfortunately we don't have any pics of the planes I don't think-- my wife had the cheapy throw-away Walmart underwater camera we bought for the trip and I had the digital camera locked in the truck, but I took pics after we were done swimming...

They were pretty darn good for learners!!!

Oh, and yeah, I'm still working on the Vanguard Eagle (to drag the thread back on topic, kicking and screaming!) LOL

OL JR

 

[RangerStl]

Ah ok...

Well, I don't think these were first timers by a long-shot-- they were flying pretty tight on each other's tails-- only maybe 150 feet or so apart, and flying pretty low (maybe a couple hundred feet or so) coming over Garner State Park, flying right over the river. In GSP, the river turns fairly sharply (in about 100 yards or so) to the left (east) after going over the four foot high dam, which backs up a nice 6 foot-ish deep swimming lake about 1/3 of a mile long or so behind it. The river turns left (east) at the foot of Old Baldy, a sheer-faced mountain essentially cut in two by the river, maybe 400-500 feet high to the summit above the river, no way those guys were higher than the summit... The river continues about 2/3 of a mile or so to a low water crossing, which dams the river up considerably and makes it about 30 yards wide, tapering down from a large gravel/rock bed at about a 20 degree angle from the shallows on the north side to about 20 feet deep at the base of the mountain tailings on the other bank (including some bus sized boulders and pretty tall bald cypresses).

I'll have to see if I can get the pics uploaded and posted... unfortunately we don't have any pics of the planes I don't think-- my wife had the cheapy throw-away Walmart underwater camera we bought for the trip and I had the digital camera locked in the truck, but I took pics after we were done swimming...

They were pretty darn good for learners!!!

Oh, and yeah, I'm still working on the Vanguard Eagle (to drag the thread back on topic, kicking and screaming!) LOL

OL JR

Actually, that kind of hot-dog garbage is how you can instantly spot the new pilots.

Sounds like they were happily ticking along thinking that "A", they could never possibly lose power in an engine, "B", they could never lose orientation and separation on the flight leader, and "C", they would never, ever encounter a ground obstacle (or big aquatic bird like a goose or heron) at low level and high speed.

That stuff kills people.

Usually takes an event that makes them soil their briefs to break them of that stuff... if they survive.

 

[Dr.Zooch]

Roger that RangerStl. Only newbees would be flat-hatting like that.

Here's how we pro.s see flying...

Step 1) Go to airport
Step 2) Climb
Step 3) Cruise
Step 4) descend
Step 5) Go to hotel
Step later) Get paycheck

Sometime later...

Repeat all steps

Live long, stay bored, retire.

The ultimate goal being to one day do as I do today... sit here at my desk with my captain's cap resting on the shelf and look out the window at the gosh awful weather outside and say gleefully to yourself "I don't have to fly in that s#!t today."

 

[Revitup]

How tight is the connection between the sustainer and booster? When I insert an engine into the sustainer, the two barely fit together. Does the shroud help with this?

 

[luke strawwalker]

How tight is the connection between the sustainer and booster? When I insert an engine into the sustainer, the two barely fit together. Does the shroud help with this?

It shouldn't be too tight, but it shouldn't be just falling apart either...

You might need to sand the tube coupler down a bit so they slip apart easier. If the stages come apart easily when there's no motor, check the end of the "stuffer tube" for an obstruction or a crease or something that's acting as a "clamp" when the motor is inserted. Make sure the upper stage motor clip isn't binding in the stuffer tube...

Test fit the end of a motor into the upper end of the stuffer tube and see if you can see what's holding up the works maybe??

Good luck! OL JR

 

[Revitup]

Here is the booster forward bulkhead. When I put an engine in the sustainer, it won't seat well. With no engine, the engine clip must be bending and going into the engine tube. Any ideas how to fix?

 

[Revitup]

Here is the engine on the sustainer.

 

[Revitup]

I found using a sharpie pen (thin point) was an excellent way to make detail on the capsule.

 

[Revitup]

Here's the entire assembly. As you can see, they fit together beautifully. Except for the fact that the engine isn't in there, so the engine clip bends into the engine tube. When I add the engine, the thing won't seat properly. The blue stripe is supposed to be flush with the top of the shroud cover. Incidentally, although I used Krylon white primer and flat white for the body tube, the fins and stripes were made with Sharpie Poster Paint markers, water based. They are a lot less messy and smelly than the spray paints or the little model acrylics.

 

[luke strawwalker]

Here is the engine on the sustainer.

The back end of your motor is awfully chewed up... looks like a puppy was working his teeth on it...

Run some sandpaper around the end of the casing to clean it up... that should help.

Also, you have to make sure that the notch in the stuffer tube aligns with the motor hook-- otherwise it won't mate properly. Depending on the upper stage fin alignment, they may not line up with the lower stage fins with the motor hook aligned with the notch...

You might want to take a bit of sandpaper and clean up the stage coupler as well...

Good luck! OL JR

 

[luke strawwalker]

I found using a sharpie pen (thin point) was an excellent way to make detail on the capsule.

That looks really nice... but no capsule rocket nozzles?? Yeah they're small, but they really add a lot of coolness to the capsule!

Later! OL JR

 

[luke strawwalker]

Here's the entire assembly. As you can see, they fit together beautifully. Except for the fact that the engine isn't in there, so the engine clip bends into the engine tube. When I add the engine, the thing won't seat properly. The blue stripe is supposed to be flush with the top of the shroud cover. Incidentally, although I used Krylon white primer and flat white for the body tube, the fins and stripes were made with Sharpie Poster Paint markers, water based. They are a lot less messy and smelly than the spray paints or the little model acrylics.

VERY nice looking rocket... The sharpie details and the blue bands really add a lot of POP to the kit!

Later! OL JR

 

[luke strawwalker]

Ok you got me interested enough in any differences and the problem that I went and dug out my Vanguard Eagle and took some pics for comparison... Here they are...

First the aft end of the upper stage... with the spent motor casing from the last flight still in the mount...

Next, the fwd end of the lower stage... see the depth of the BT-55 tube down to the centering rings, and the notches and vent holes in the stuffer tube...

Last, the stages coupled together (with the spent motor still in the upper stage).

I'm gonna have to run errands, but you can compare the pics and see if anything jumps out of you as 'out of the ordinary'. I'll do the same when I get back and post back here later...

Good luck! OL JR